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Old 07-20-2020, 02:18 AM   #1
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Question on Trucks

So I have been towing our RL38 with 8K Is and disk brakes now for 2 seasons. We are over the GVW for the trailer because the original axels where 7K rated back in 2015 . I have scaled our rig several times and depending on how much water I put in the fresh water tank is what puts us over the 16,500GVW on the trailer. I currently know if I have over 30 gallons of water I am over weight on the rear axle of my SRW GMC 3500 and right at the max combine weight rating for the truck. This brings me to my question , Is a crew cab duel wheel 3500 enough truck for long distance towing? Motor wise my 2016 is the bare min power I would want , its rate at 397 HP and 765 TQ but there is all kind of games being played by the EMC limiting TQ depending on the gear the trans is in. long 4% grades will pull the truck down to 50-55mph in 4th gear. I am looking at a 2020 GMC 3500 DRW and maybe considering looking at a medium duty or class 8 tractor . money wise there is some delta that I don't know exactly what that gap is at this point but we are thinking of maybe planning a few 3000 4000 mile trips like out west Yellowstone and south. The trips out west will not be in the next year but my wife is willing and I want her and the cat to be comfortable for the ride. I am considering a retired class 8 single axle tractor with a small sleeper that used , just not sure if the one ton is enough truck. For those of you that have class 6-9 trucks is there any draw backs for insurance , registration or driver lic?

Please add your comments and thank you for your advice!
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Old 07-20-2020, 05:23 AM   #2
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Can't help with the MDT, but after hauling our RW, loaded to just over the max, on factory 7k axles for 60-70k miles with a '13 GMC D/A dually coast to coast border to border & never found a mountain it wouldn't climb with relative ease. The DRW GMC was as big as I'd want to cruise around sightseeing in or parking at the grocery store & am certain the DW wouldn't have driven a MDT.
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Old 07-20-2020, 08:14 PM   #3
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I agree with Danny. Your problem is not your truck's power train rather the lack of 4 tires on the rear! I have not heard of anyone yet, unless they pull it empty, pull with a SRW for long!
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Old 07-20-2020, 08:22 PM   #4
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I agree with Danny. Your problem is not your truck's power train rather the lack of 4 tires on the rear! I have not heard of anyone yet, unless they pull it empty, pull with a SRW for long!
However, you will be greatly impressed at the difference in HP and Torque in the 2015 vs 2020.
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Old 07-20-2020, 08:26 PM   #5
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I have had both a 2008 F450 and now a 2018 F350 SRW. If I were to go full time I would only do it with a Dually and in fact I am considering going back. But we are only weekenders currently and don't usually go more than 200 miles from home and run very light. The SRW pulls it fine plenty of power but I can feel the stability difference.
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Old 07-20-2020, 10:53 PM   #6
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OK, here's my take:
We're not Full Timers, but are considered Most Timers normally spending 8 to 10 months in our RW, have just under 50K miles on it in just over 5 years.
Our RW was ordered with the 8K axles to give it a Gross of 17.9K, that rating only because of the 18K rating on the Tri-Glide which it has been in MORryde's scrape yard for a few years now. We have been scaled slightly over 19K on the RW and have had NO suspension issues.
We pulled for a number of years with a 2011 Silverado Dually and never had an issue, and now we have a 2018 Silverado Dually and can climb that long North grade in Fancy Gap Virginia, drop it to fourth and cruise at 60 and pass all the Semi's in the truck lane.
If you go for the 2020 you'll get the benefit of the new 10 speed tranny, that so far I have only heard good things about it.
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Old 07-21-2020, 01:06 AM   #7
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I cannot speak for DRW's, BUT I can tell you about the new 2020's... they are freakin tow/haul machines....

With the new 10 speed trans, the torque of 1050 ft lbs and almost 500 HP, it is a beast !

IF you decide on a new 2020, a DRW will be enough to to any RW.

Just comparing the tow to my past 2015, there is NO comparison.... NONE ! Night and day difference . I never had an ounce of concern towing my 2016 38RL with my 2015 SRW.. when I jumped into the 2020 3991RD, I knew I was at my limits of payload and RAWR.....Now the Problem is solved ....

Any of the Big 3 new generation trucks are just down right beasts.....
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Old 07-21-2020, 01:19 AM   #8
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So what I am getting out of this conversation is with duel 17" tires you feel much more stable and sure footed and are comfortable running at or slightly faster then the posted speed limits on twisty country roads. power wise I know there is a nice improvement with just going to a 2017 and new truck and the 2020 truck takes the leash off the power that the Allison 6 speeds had to have in 1st gear and 5and 6th gear . I just dont want to go back to the well and pull more money out in 2 years again for a truck upgrade. I can live with a one ton daily driver , I have done it for 8 years so far . Don't want to make a big mistake and have to live with it for several years.

How are the 2020 truck as far as the rear springs , can they handle the pin weight of 3500lbs and a 300-500lb hitch with a extra fuel tank in the bed without air bags?
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Old 07-21-2020, 01:36 AM   #9
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Mark,

With my truck STOCK, I hooked up to the Redwood and the rear dropped about 2-1/2"... that was with 3460# pin

I installed a Firestone Ride Rite Kit with its own compressor, I wanted to ride level. The new Rams have the auto leveling air kits which are a nice option.
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Old 07-21-2020, 02:18 AM   #10
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I see a lot of posts on the forum about airbags but I'm just curious as to why no one talks about SumoSprings. Does anyone have an opinion on them?
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Old 07-21-2020, 05:26 AM   #11
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Quote:
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I see a lot of posts on the forum about airbags but I'm just curious as to why no one talks about SumoSprings. Does anyone have an opinion on them?
I had the Timbrens which work on the same principal, keep the a## off of those stiff overloads, that worked great.
I didn't need the leveling of the air bags as the RW only dropped the rear just enough to level both for towing, but that put it only about a 1/2" off the overloads that created a very harsh ride at every little bump, the Timbrens softened that by keeping it from slamming into those overloads.
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Old 07-21-2020, 08:24 AM   #12
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I had the Timbrens which work on the same principal, keep the a## off of those stiff overloads, that worked great.
I didn't need the leveling of the air bags as the RW only dropped the rear just enough to level both for towing, but that put it only about a 1/2" off the overloads that created a very harsh ride at every little bump, the Timbrens softened that by keeping it from slamming into those overloads.
Thanks for the response Danny. I knew there was one person on the forum that had them but couldn't remember who. After much research and debate between airbags and the sumo springs, my husband opted to get the sumo springs and installed them just last week. We pick up our new 4001LK on Monday so we're going to find out how well they work.
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Old 07-22-2020, 01:50 AM   #13
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I had the Timbrens which work on the same principal, keep the a## off of those stiff overloads, that worked great.
I didn't need the leveling of the air bags as the RW only dropped the rear just enough to level both for towing, but that put it only about a 1/2" off the overloads that created a very harsh ride at every little bump, the Timbrens softened that by keeping it from slamming into those overloads.
And for the record, my 2015 really sat close to level when towing, and sat high in the rear when empty... The new 2020 sits lower in the rear. It is almost level, just about 3/4" off when not towing, so the rear was about 2" below level when hooked up.
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Old 07-28-2020, 01:32 AM   #14
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Ditto, what they said, I have a 2008 f 350 ford 6.4L deleted, custom tunes for engine and transmission for fuel mpg mostly. 75k miles ( use for towing mostly) It was replacement for a 1999 Chevrolet 3500 with a 454 City gas guzzler . I pulled a 94 Kountry Aire fifth wheel East to west & north to south for several years. High elevations, ice and snow. Redwoods are not as heavy as that three axles beast. I would say your truck is fine, on really steep grades, all Trucks are going to slow down to some extent
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Old 09-06-2020, 12:00 PM   #15
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Is any one towing with a 2020 GM DRW truck and pulling redwood ? did you have any issues with setting the hitch up to get it level and maintaining at a minimum 6" of bed rail clearance? GM did redesign the frame rails to reduce the bed floor loading height but the raised the bed rails by almost the same amount. I have Hensley BD5 on order and want to know if I should try to adjust anything at this point ?
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Old 09-13-2020, 03:28 PM   #16
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Trucks

What about the 2019 Next Generation GMC Sierra 2500? The towing capacity is 18.500 lbs. We have a 2014 38rl . Our campers weight is 13.5 and loaded, about 15k. We purchased the truck a few weeks ago, and then last friday, was hit from behind at 65mph while stopped for a garbage truck.
The car that hit us was totaled, and our GMC , and God really came thru.
It did bend the frame, bumper , tail gate, and pushed the bed up to the cab, but , it really saved our life. So, said all that because they may total the truck, and we were wondering if we should bump up to the 3500.
But Definately staying with the GMC.
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Old 09-13-2020, 05:10 PM   #17
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First off the tow ratings assigned to all brands of trucks are established hauling a low profile trailer loaded with blocks directly over the axles which in no way compares to hauling/towing any rv that has the aerodynamics of a brick. Mostly it's just a "mines bigger" competition between truck manufacturers.
Look at the yellow/white sticker inside the drivers door it will state "occupants & cargo must not exceed XXXX lbs", this is the payload for that particular truck, not all are the same, from that number subtract the weight of all people, pets, the hitch, everything that's been added to the truck since it left the factory & the pin weight of your rv.
Use the GVWR for your rv, printed on the manufacturer tag on the driver side front corner, to figure your pin weight, at some point you will tow it at that weight. To arrive at that weight use 20-25% of the GVWR, if I recall the RLs tend to run a bit pin heavy so 25% is what I'd use.
Using these numbers most of those new trucks will be over their payload long before you'd ever haul the max weight towing a rv. I think the manufacturers are really confusing the public by publishing these outrageous max towing weights along with rv manufacturers posting dry rv weights which mean ABSOLUTELY nothing to the consumer, they will NEVER tow it at that weight.
To be honest the best choice is a diesel dually, I also would choose the GMC.
Sorry for the long winded explanation!
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Old 09-13-2020, 05:33 PM   #18
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I am a BIG advocate for towing with a properly equipped SRW.... BUT, there is no way a 2500 is capable enough to tow a Redwood of that size.

Heck, my 2015 F350 SRW was right at or slightly over some of my numbers and I was ok with that, now my 2020 F350 SRW is within ALL my numbers... BUT just enough due to the fact that w are weekend warriors and do not have a lot of stuff In there.... Sure, a 2500 can TOW a Redwood....... BUT it CANNOT CARRY the pin weight in the bed..... stressing the axle and tires.


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Old 09-13-2020, 05:38 PM   #19
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I second the Dually, you might squeeze by with a 350/3500 SRW, BUT more than likely you would be pushing the numbers.
I also agree about the crazy towing numbers, some are up into the low 30K, but once you figure the fifth wheel pin on that amount you're way over payload. And I think that load of bricks is on a Goose Neck trailer, that carry most of their weight on the axles with lighter tongue weight.
Suggest you don't become one of the 250/2500 owners, then spend more money trying to make it do the job of a Dually.
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Old 09-13-2020, 09:53 PM   #20
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First off the tow ratings assigned to all brands of trucks are established hauling a low profile trailer loaded with blocks directly over the axles which in no way compares to hauling/towing any rv that has the aerodynamics of a brick. Mostly it's just a "mines bigger" competition between truck manufacturers.
Look at the yellow/white sticker inside the drivers door it will state "occupants & cargo must not exceed XXXX lbs", this is the payload for that particular truck, not all are the same, from that number subtract the weight of all people, pets, the hitch, everything that's been added to the truck since it left the factory & the pin weight of your rv.
Use the GVWR for your rv, printed on the manufacturer tag on the driver side front corner, to figure your pin weight, at some point you will tow it at that weight. To arrive at that weight use 20-25% of the GVWR, if I recall the RLs tend to run a bit pin heavy so 25% is what I'd use.
Using these numbers most of those new trucks will be over their payload long before you'd ever haul the max weight towing a rv. I think the manufacturers are really confusing the public by publishing these outrageous max towing weights along with rv manufacturers posting dry rv weights which mean ABSOLUTELY nothing to the consumer, they will NEVER tow it at that weight.
To be honest the best choice is a diesel dually, I also would choose the GMC.
Sorry for the long winded explanation!
BTW! I failed to mention the axle weight ratings & the tires, none of the numbers should be exceeded regardless of what ridiculous amount they say it might be able to tow.
Read any other towable rv forum & you'll find countless members that have fallen into the max towable weight gimmick to tow their dry weight rv only to find out both of those numbers mean nothing of any use to them.
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