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Old 06-04-2015, 12:18 AM   #1
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3/4 Ton?

The tow specs on my 2012 Ram 2500 are as follows:
Max Towing 14,500
Payload 2270
The 2012 Redwood we'd like to buy weighs in at 12,700 with a CCC of 3300. Clearly we would have to be careful of loading until a 1 ton is feasible but I think we could manage.
Pin weight is 2660, nearly 400 lbs over.
While I don't want to stir up the weight police, I'd just like to see if anyone online has towed with this setup before and how did it work out.

Jim
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Old 06-04-2015, 12:27 AM   #2
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Think you answered your own question. Nearly 400lbs over and that is empty. I would not do it
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Old 06-04-2015, 01:39 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j_a_wolfe View Post
The tow specs on my 2012 Ram 2500 are as follows:
Max Towing 14,500
Payload 2270
The 2012 Redwood we'd like to buy weighs in at 12,700 with a CCC of 3300. Clearly we would have to be careful of loading until a 1 ton is feasible but I think we could manage.
Pin weight is 2660, nearly 400 lbs over.
While I don't want to stir up the weight police, I'd just like to see if anyone online has towed with this setup before and how did it work out.

Jim
Jim
Have you actually weighed the trailer. It seems light even for the 31sl which is the smallest. I have friends that tow 4 2 ft toy haulers a lot heavier than That with 2500's the truck will pull it but the problem is if you get in a wreck overloaded it will cost you
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Old 06-04-2015, 03:56 AM   #4
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Shane,
I have no doubt that the truck will pull it. The torque and horsepower ratings have steadily climbed over the last few years. My concern is the fact that I'd be over on the pin weight. I can afford a new truck or replace the fifth wheel but not both. We found the 36RL that we fell in love with at a show when it was new. Karma is taunting me but I'm afraid the Safety Nazi in me isn't going to allow me to make this deal. . .
Jim
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Old 06-04-2015, 04:04 AM   #5
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A buddy of mine had a 3/4 ton GMC and purchased a big horn. All he said was it was to scary on the road. He soon went to a 1 ton single and said it was ok.
I had done a lot of research since we purchased are RW before we had the truck. My opinion is diesel which gives you more power then you need and we actually got 14.2 mpg on our last trip. Dually is also a must have for me. Just seems more stable and when you see the monster behind you a little extra truck doesn't hurt.

I would be very scared with a 3/4 ton unless you plan on staying local.
This is only my opinion and others may disagree.

Steve
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Old 06-04-2015, 04:10 AM   #6
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I believe if your involved in an accident and found to be over weight, bad things could happen.
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Old 06-04-2015, 04:17 AM   #7
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Not wanting to start a rant fest but. . .
Has anyone been personally involved in an accident while overweight and was that an issue? I have heard the urban myth but have yet to find a single documented case where this is an issue. I'm more concerned about the safety of myself ans passengers than with liability issues but would like to determine if liability is a real problem or something that might "end up on your permanent record. "


Jim
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Old 06-04-2015, 04:18 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j_a_wolfe View Post
Shane,
I have no doubt that the truck will pull it. The torque and horsepower ratings have steadily climbed over the last few years. My concern is the fact that I'd be over on the pin weight. I can afford a new truck or replace the fifth wheel but not both. We found the 36RL that we fell in love with at a show when it was new. Karma is taunting me but I'm afraid the Safety Nazi in me isn't going to allow me to make this deal. . .
Jim
Jim
if you are only using it for weekend camping and not pulling across the country you will be ok. Until you can upgradeThe rear end on the 2500, 250 is the same as a 1 ton. Limitations are tires and rims that get overloaded. The 36rl has a pin weight of 3500 lbs and the 3/4 ton is good for 1100 lbs pin weight
you will be overloaded. Mechanically you should have no problem. Just don't run into anyone
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Old 06-04-2015, 04:45 AM   #9
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I have seen several rvers in various parks pulling, IMHO, with not nearly enough truck be it travel trailers or 5ers & like you I have heard the stories of liability, but don't anyone to verify. That doesn't make it right, but you won't be only one out there. Drive safe & enjoy your RW!!
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Old 06-04-2015, 04:46 AM   #10
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Shane,
To clarify, the pin weight on the 36RL is posted to be 2660 lbs.
The rated capacity of my 3/4 ton Ram is 2270.
My concern would be once loaded, the 400 pounds might climb to ??
Jim
PS. The tires and rims on my 3/4 ton are identical to the ones on a 1 ton SRW.
Jim
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Old 06-04-2015, 04:55 AM   #11
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Jim- I have an RL. Towed it first with a F350 CC SB SRW. I was 700 lbs overweight on rear axle with that truck. I know the brochure says 2660 lbs ro 36RL pin weight "....... I don't know of anyone's that is that light. Mine is 3550 and that's without a GenSet.

As said, if you are staying local, maybe, but know that your rear tires will be overloaded.
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Old 06-04-2015, 11:20 AM   #12
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I towed our SOB previous 5th Wheel with a 3/4 ton truck that was similar length and weight, it was 40' long, weighted 15,700 lbs. and had a pin weight of 3,600 lbs. (brochure pin weight was 2,550 lbs.).
I had air bags on the truck to keep it level due to the pin weight.
I made a trip from Florida to Texas with the 3/4 ton, it pulled the 5th Wheel ok but stability was a problem, when we got back to Florida we traded for a 1 ton dually and wow what a difference.
Now that we have our Redwood, it is about 1,000 lbs. heaver, I sure am glad we have the 1 ton dually.
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Old 06-04-2015, 12:23 PM   #13
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In April 2014 I bought Ram 2500 4x4 6.7 with a 16k tow capacity which is very close to my 2012 36RE. Was very light on rear axle capacity so I added air system to rear. Power was fine but handling was not what I had hoped (traded an 11 Ram 3500 DRW). Because I have disc brakes on the trailer stopped fine.
On the 2014 they only offered a 3.42 rear end. In August pulling from Phoenix to Flagstaff I blew up the rear end. Traded it for a 2014 3500 DRW.
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Old 06-04-2015, 02:41 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by j_a_wolfe View Post
The tow specs on my 2012 Ram 2500 are as follows:
Max Towing 14,500
Payload 2270
The 2012 Redwood we'd like to buy weighs in at 12,700 with a CCC of 3300. Clearly we would have to be careful of loading until a 1 ton is feasible but I think we could manage.
Pin weight is 2660, nearly 400 lbs over.
While I don't want to stir up the weight police, I'd just like to see if anyone online has towed with this setup before and how did it work out.

Jim
I would be careful with your weight estimates. I too also bought a used 2012 36RL last year. The weight on the unit from the factory, as listed on a sticker in the closet door was 14,200. The unit did come with a washer dryer but no genset. The unit you are looking at cannot weigh much less than mine.

There is a reason that the truck manufacturers give the ratings that they do for these trucks. The second set of wheels on the ground make a big difference. The axle ratio makes even a bigger difference. The transmission will make a difference. The difference between a 2012 Ram and a 2014 Ram 2500 is huge. In 2013 for the 3500 series trucks Ram put a whole new frame, redesigned front and rear ends that boosted there tow ratings tremendously. These changes were not applied to the 2500 series until 2014. When in was shopping for a truck I quickly determined I needed a 2013 over a 2102 model as it was a huge difference in capability.

In my opinion it is too much trailer for the truck. My 2013 Ram 3500 DRW 4:10 has a payload of 5960 and a tow rating of 21,790. Add an Asin transmission and the tow rating goes to 29,130. The RW is rock solid behind the truck with no modifications. Keep in mind you will likely blow away all other recommended weights on the truck as well.
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Old 06-04-2015, 03:33 PM   #15
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The truck should always drive the trailer. The trailer should never drive the truck.
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Old 06-04-2015, 04:00 PM   #16
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I asked the same questions 2 years ago - looking through forums for permission to tow my new 2014 36RL with a SRW F350. I mixed and mashed numbers, filtered out what I didn't want to hear from others, until I finally felt justified. I bought the 36RL and hit the scales. Tires were overloaded - not to mention pin weight. 2600 advertised pin weight turned to 4300 lbs (with water) actual weight and 3600 lbs without water.

Within 30 days, I had a dually. Didn't want a dually, don't like dually's, but I have a dually because I got myself in a pickle that I couldn't easily get backed out of. Talk axles and gears and air bags and all the junk you want, but when the tires are over the max load, I draw the line.

But it sounds like you have been down this road before - as you already know the metaphors and terms better than most.
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Old 06-04-2015, 05:14 PM   #17
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And I'm sure Brad (atom ant) will tell you the same thing I will ......... I loved my F350 SRW but after towing with a Dually, I'll never consider towing anything with a single wheel again. That includes the boat, the car trailer or any other trailer. Difference in stability and control is nothing short of astounding.


Just my .02
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Old 06-04-2015, 06:23 PM   #18
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The other thing to consider is the additional weight on the pin that comes from the propane tanks and especially the fresh water tank that's ahead of the trailer axles. That water tank if filled could weigh maybe 8oo lb. and some of that weight will be on the pin (using the Civil Engineer's bridge formula), same could apply to the black and gray water tanks (more additional pin weight!).

In a couple of occasions we've decided that the campsite dump station wasn't convenient (or we've dry camped) so we've run with partially full tanks to the next stop, running with material in your tanks could really put you over on weight with a SRW

One of my friends with a 36RL and a SRW had to ensure that he ran with empty tanks to be safe, it's something that's a hassle and he decided to go with a dually for that reason alone.
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Old 06-04-2015, 07:01 PM   #19
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There are other Redwood models that may be proportioned differently, and even other brands, but the 36RL and 36FB run heavy on the pin. Almost everything of weight is on or ahead of the axles.

Piper guy is right, no doubt, the dually is a sure footed stable towing machine, but its not a friendly daily driver. I would never promote a dually if it wasn't needed, but if you really want to enjoy the capability and capacity of that 36RL you are going to need more than that 2500.

Here is my weight ticket WITHOUT any food or water:

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Old 06-05-2015, 12:48 AM   #20
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Brad's post prompted me to look at my weight stickers,
My 2014 Ford F450 dry was 9320
With trailer loaded:
Steer Axle 5460
Drive Axle 7900
TrailerAxle 13100

That leaves my pin weight right at 4040.
I had SWR 2012 F350. It just didn't have the load capacity. Although the F350 DRW was sufficient, I opted for the F450 since it has a shorter (9 1/2 feet) turning radius.

Ken
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